Timing Issue

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Old 15 Jun 2009, 01:10 pm   #1 (permalink)
Kdawg
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Default Timing Issue

Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and when
i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to do
next. Any help is appreciated.
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Old 15 Jun 2009, 01:34 pm   #2 (permalink)
C. E. White
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Default Re: Timing Issue


"Kdawg" <spiker2306@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ee140847-651c-47de-b432-73bb0c2e6d66@z8g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
> was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
> the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and
> when
> i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
> the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
> injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
> white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
> and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to
> do
> next. Any help is appreciated.


Are you sure you the cam is not 180 degrees off compared to the crank
(two crank revolutions per single cam revolution). You need to
determine Top Dead Center for the #1 cylinder and then verify that
intake and exhaut valves for that cylinder are both closed.

Ed


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Old 15 Jun 2009, 04:32 pm   #3 (permalink)
Kdawg
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 15, 2:34*pm, "C. E. White" <cewhi...@removemindspring.com>
wrote:
> "Kdawg" <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ee140847-651c-47de-b432-73bb0c2e6d66@z8g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
> > was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
> > the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and
> > when
> > i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
> > the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
> > injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
> > white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
> > and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to
> > do
> > next. Any help is appreciated.

>
> Are you sure you the cam is not 180 degrees off compared to the crank
> (two crank revolutions per single cam revolution). You need to
> determine Top Dead Center for the #1 cylinder and then verify that
> intake and exhaut valves for that cylinder are both closed.
>
> Ed


180 the cam still giving some smoke through the intake, both valves
were closed so i set back to original timing marks, was running lil
but reverse operation sucking through exhuast and out intake, cant get
it started either normal or 180. Any other suggestions for the 180
idea?
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Old 16 Jun 2009, 11:31 am   #4 (permalink)
ycleptor2@sc.com
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 15, 5:32*pm, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jun 15, 2:34*pm, "C. E. White" <cewhi...@removemindspring.com>


>
> *180 the cam still giving some smoke through the intake, both valves
> were closed so i set back to original timing marks, was running lil
> but reverse operation sucking through exhuast and out intake, cant get
> it started either normal or 180. Any other suggestions for the 180
> idea?


It might be more complicated than being 180 degrees out if the hatch
marks, etc. were not aligned properly when you reassembled the front
of the engine.

Check out pages EM16-EM28 in the gen 4 manual. Not only does cylinder
1 need to be TDC compression, but some other pulleys need to be
aligned properly as well (crank pulley, camshaft timing pulley, and
oil pump pulley):

http://camrystuff.com/index.php?page=Gen4_Manuals

Good luck,
MD



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Old 17 Jun 2009, 07:47 pm   #5 (permalink)
Kdawg
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 16, 12:31*pm, "yclept...@sc.com" <yclep...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Jun 15, 5:32*pm, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jun 15, 2:34*pm, "C. E. White" <cewhi...@removemindspring.com>

>
> > *180 the cam still giving some smoke through the intake, both valves
> > were closed so i set back to original timing marks, was running lil
> > but reverse operation sucking through exhuast and out intake, cant get
> > it started either normal or 180. Any other suggestions for the 180
> > idea?

>
> It might be more complicated than being 180 degrees out if the hatch
> marks, etc. were not aligned properly when you reassembled the front
> of the engine.
>
> Check out pages EM16-EM28 in the gen 4 manual. Not only does cylinder
> 1 need to be TDC compression, but some other pulleys need to be
> aligned properly as well (crank pulley, camshaft timing pulley, and
> oil pump pulley):
>
> http://camrystuff.com/index.php?page=Gen4_Manuals
>
> Good luck,
> MD


its all timed up, but still not starting, getting spark and injectors
are firing. the only reason it wont start could be that i might have
bent a valve. would this issue cause it not to start?
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Old 18 Jun 2009, 06:44 am   #6 (permalink)
C. E. White
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Default Re: Timing Issue


"Kdawg" <spiker2306@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3db35cd1-728e-4f41-9c9a-2fc813500057@y7g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...

> its all timed up, but still not starting, getting spark and
> injectors
> are firing. the only reason it wont start could be that i might have
> bent a valve. would this issue cause it not to start?


Do a compression test....

Ed


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Old 18 Jun 2009, 12:27 pm   #7 (permalink)
ycleptor2@sc.com
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 17, 8:47*pm, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:



> its all timed up, but still not starting, getting spark and injectors
> are firing. the only reason it wont start could be that i might have
> bent a valve. would this issue cause it not to start?


I don't think the 4 cylinder is an interference engine, so valves
shouldn't be bent. The diagnostic table for a crank but doesn't start
(page DI-28 of the manual in the link above) mentions ECM power source
circuit, fuel pump control circuit, and the ECM. Incomplete combustion
without a start says check the fueld pump control circuit. For an
engine that cranks normally but is difficult to start, the chart says
check the starter signal control circuit, fuel pump control circuit,
and compression.

Good luck,
MD
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Old 18 Jun 2009, 11:22 pm   #8 (permalink)
john
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Default Re: Timing Issue

If everything worked before you replaced the old timing belt, then I'd
first check all the things/connectors you had to remove to get to the
belt. It's usually something simple. Try disconnecting the connectors
and plugging them back in again. Check the ground straps. Making sure
you lined up the correct marks on the pulleys. etc etc.

Valves don't suddenly bend and piston rings don't suddenly wear out
before and after a timing belt job.


On Jun 15, 11:10*am, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
> was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
> the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and when
> i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
> the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
> injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
> white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
> and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to do
> next. Any help is appreciated.


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Old 19 Jun 2009, 10:56 am   #9 (permalink)
Kdawg
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 19, 12:22*am, john <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> If everything worked before you replaced the old timing belt, then I'd
> first check all the things/connectors you had to remove to get to the
> belt. It's usually something simple. Try disconnecting the connectors
> and plugging them back in again. Check the ground straps. Making sure
> you lined up the correct marks on the pulleys. etc etc.
>
> Valves don't suddenly bend and piston rings don't suddenly wear out
> before and after a timing belt job.
>
> On Jun 15, 11:10*am, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
> > was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
> > the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and when
> > i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
> > the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
> > injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
> > white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
> > and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to do
> > next. Any help is appreciated.


i'll recheck my connections again, did start up once but didnt idle
right so i turned it off and ever since just couldnt get it started
but i think it might be a connector as well
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Old 14 Jul 2009, 12:12 pm   #10 (permalink)
Kdawg
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Default Re: Timing Issue

On Jun 19, 10:56*am, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jun 19, 12:22*am, john <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > If everything worked before you replaced the old timing belt, then I'd
> > first check all the things/connectors you had to remove to get to the
> > belt. It's usually something simple. Try disconnecting the connectors
> > and plugging them back in again. Check the ground straps. Making sure
> > you lined up the correct marks on the pulleys. etc etc.

>
> > Valves don't suddenly bend and piston rings don't suddenly wear out
> > before and after a timing belt job.

>
> > On Jun 15, 11:10*am, Kdawg <spiker2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> > > Im dealing with a 97 toyota camry, original problem was my oil pump
> > > was leaking severly. Took all the components off necessary to access
> > > the pump and replaced the seal. Replaced the old timing belt and when
> > > i tried to start it, nothing happened. Tinkered around some more and
> > > the cam is timed with crank, im getting air out the exhuast, fuel
> > > injectors are firing as well as the spark plugs, but also getting
> > > white smoke that smells little of gas, cranks just fine but wont run
> > > and get some white smoke out the intake. I have no clue of what to do
> > > next. Any help is appreciated.

>
> i'll recheck my connections again, did start up once but didnt idle
> right so i turned it off and ever since just couldnt get it started
> but i think it might be a connector as well


So i put everything back together all the connections are good, timing
is correct, spark plugs are firing injectors are firing no blown
fuses, tested the major wire components all are in specs but now it
sorta starts up for like 1 second then goes back to regular crank but
no start. Im completely lost and confused right. made sure cylinders
were not flooded and still not getting a start.
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