Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

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Old 05 Jul 2009, 02:18 pm   #1 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

About 7 months ago, I mailed to Blackstone Labs a used motor oil
sample that came out of my oil pan's drain plug when I did an oil
change. Here are the results of the UOA (used oil analysis).

OCI means Oil Change Interval.
PP means Pennzoil Platinum, a synthetic oil (Group III anyway).


6-month OCI (from May 16 to November 12, 2008).
Toyota OEM air and oil filters (Denso 90915-YZZF1).
19,620 total car miles.

This was my second consecutive fill with PP 5w-30 (API SM & GF-4).
I had previously used Mobil 1 and Valvoline Conventional.
Always gentle driving on roads in Columbia, Missouri and St. Louis.

Special Notes: The first 3,200 miles of this approximate 5,000-mile
OCI was exclusive city driving with most trips averaging somewhere
between 15 miles and 30 miles (all city, again). The next 1,700 miles
of this OCI was a 50/50 mix of city and highway.

On the actual day of the oil change, just before changing the oil, I
drove the car about 30 miles on the highway, then let it idle
15 minutes while I brought out the ramps and other equipment.

Although my manual calls for 4 quarts of oil when changing the oil
and oil filter, I always put in 4.25 quarts.

This is Toyota's 2.4L 2AZ-FE engine, an inline 4 cylinder.

Blackstone-Labs results:

Miles on oil: 4,920
Miles on engine: 19,610
Sample date: 11/12/2008 ; Report date: 11/24/2008
Makeup oil added: 0

[First number = my sample's results] , [Second number = Universal Averages
for this engine]

Aluminum 3 , 3
Chromium 0 , 0
Iron 7 , 10

Copper 1 , 2
Lead 3 , 2
Tin 0 , 1

Molybdenum 53 , 90
Nickel 0 , 0
Manganese 0 , 0

Silver 0 , 0
Titanium 0 , 0

---------
Potassium 2 , 1
Boron 28 , 39
Silicon 17 , 17
Sodium 4 , 14
---------

Calcium 2795 , 2347
Magnesium 15 , 121
Phosphorous 714 , 719
Zinc 860 , 853
Barium 1 , 0

MY RESULTS // VALUES SHOULD BE

SUS Viscosity @ 210* F = 59.3 // 56 - 63
cSt Viscosity @ 100* C = 10.03 // 9.1 - 11.3
Flashpoint in * F = 400 // > 365

Fuel % is < 0.5 // < 2.0
Antifreeze % = 0.0 // 0.0
Water % = 0.0 // < 0.1
Insolubles % = 0.2 // < 0.6

TBN = 4.7
TAN = 0.9

Built_Well's Note: The UOA cost about $22 or so. The TAN and the TBN
readings cost an extra $10 each, and you gotta request them at Blackstone
if you want them. I forgot to request the TAN, but I emailed them a day
after receiving my results, and they pulled my oil sample and ran the TAN.
I was happy that they hadn't immediately thrown away my oil sample after
running the standard tests the day before. I don't know how long they keep
the oil samples, though.

Anyway, I wanted a TAN (Total Acid Number) reading just for fun to compare
it to RLI's Bio-Syn reading when I send the used Bio-Syn 0w-30 to
Blackstone in the future (RLI is Renewable Lubricants, Inc's oil available
at RenewableLube.com). The results above for the used Pennzoil Platinum
5w-30 oil happened during moderate temperatures and weather from May to
November (mostly Summer and Fall). I think it'll be interesting to compare
the nice weather PP results to the harsh weather Bio-Syn results (Winter).

Finally, I think the numbers that Blackstone provides for the "Universal
Averages" for the Toyota aluminum 2AZ-FE engine are from many oil samples
tested with an average distance of 4,600 miles for the many samples sent
in by their customers.

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Old 05 Jul 2009, 03:13 pm   #2 (permalink)
HLS
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles


"Built_Well" <Built_Well_Toyota@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4a50fc7c$0$28140$892e0abb@auth.newsreader.oct anews.com...
> About 7 months ago, I mailed to Blackstone Labs a used motor oil
> sample that came out of my oil pan's drain plug when I did an oil
> change. Here are the results of the UOA (used oil analysis).


And the winner is?

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Old 05 Jul 2009, 03:46 pm   #3 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

HLS wrote:

> Built_Well wrote:
>
>> About 7 months ago, I mailed to Blackstone Labs a used motor oil
>> sample that came out of my oil pan's drain plug when I did an oil
>> change. Here are the results of the UOA (used oil analysis).
>> =======

>
> And the winner is?

========

Can't say yet who the winner is. The RLI Bio-Syn 0w-30 is still in
the car ;-)

It's great oil--the motor is so, so quiet. Start-ups during the
winter were so easy, too (effortless).

Next I'll try Amsoil 0w-30.
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 04:15 pm   #4 (permalink)
Scott Dorsey
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

Built_Well <Built_Well_Toyota@hotmail.com> wrote:
>HLS wrote:
>
>> Built_Well wrote:
>>
>>> About 7 months ago, I mailed to Blackstone Labs a used motor oil
>>> sample that came out of my oil pan's drain plug when I did an oil
>>> change. Here are the results of the UOA (used oil analysis).
>>> =======

>>
>> And the winner is?

>========
>
>Can't say yet who the winner is. The RLI Bio-Syn 0w-30 is still in
>the car ;-)
>
>It's great oil--the motor is so, so quiet. Start-ups during the
>winter were so easy, too (effortless).
>
>Next I'll try Amsoil 0w-30.


Umm.... you're really not going to be able to make _any_ judgement at
all with a single test on each oil.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 04:54 pm   #5 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

Scott Dorsey wrote:
>
> Umm.... you're really not going to be able to make _any_ judgement at all
> with a single test on each oil.

========

Umm, I'm less interested in finding a winner than safely extending my
OCIs (oil change intervals) to 6,000 or 7,000 miles :-P

Here's what Blackstone-Labs.com had to say about the Pennzoil
Platinum 5w-30 UOA in the Camry:

"All wear read near or below averages for this type of engine, which
is a very good indication of normal wearing parts and careful operation.
The universal averages show normal wear after ~4,600 miles on the
oil. Insolubles (oil oxidation due to heat, use, and blow-by) were
low at 0.2%, showing good oil filtration. No fuel dilution or
anti-freeze was found. Silicon was normal at 17 ppm (parts per
million), so your air filtration is still getting the job done.
The TBN (Total Base Number) read 4.7. 1.0 is considered low, so
plenty of the additive was still active. Nothing abnormal was
found. Looks like a nice engine."

Later in an email correspondence, Blackstone Labs stated:

"As far as the oil use goes, I think you could easily go
past 5,000 miles for the oil change and 7,000 miles would
be a good sampling point next time. If everything continues
to look good, we'll suggest going even longer after that."
[End Quote]

Well, I don't plan on ever extending beyond 7,000 miles, but if
I wanted to do 5,000-mile and 6-month oil changes, the
non-synthetic Castrol GTX would probably suffice, as it appears
to be one of the best dinos from a UOA perspective. But I
don't really relish getting underneath the car anymore, so my
preference is 6,000 or 7,000 miles changes and up to 10 months
time.

I'll probably even use an oversized filter next time like the
Mobil 1 209 in place of the specified Mobil 1 103 (some people
do that), but the 103 would probably be fine too. Right now
I'm still using the OEM spec'ed Denso filter (YZZF1). For the
next UOA, I'll get a particulate count so I can compare the
Denso with the future Mobil 1.

I guess this isn't all about fun. It's also about saving time
and getting underneath the car less often. And I'd rather not
have to trust dealers and independent shops to do the work.
Nobody will do the work better than you, as we saw with the
over-torqued lug nuts on my Camry, when the dealer rotated
the tires ;-)
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 05:20 pm   #6 (permalink)
Scott Dorsey
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

Built_Well <Built_Well_Toyota@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Scott Dorsey wrote:
>>
>> Umm.... you're really not going to be able to make _any_ judgement at all
>> with a single test on each oil.

>
>Umm, I'm less interested in finding a winner than safely extending my
>OCIs (oil change intervals) to 6,000 or 7,000 miles :-P


And what do you think you will find on a single data point that will tell
you something that will help this?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 05:51 pm   #7 (permalink)
Vic Smith
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

On 5 Jul 2009 18:20:12 -0400, kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

>Built_Well <Built_Well_Toyota@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>Scott Dorsey wrote:
>>>
>>> Umm.... you're really not going to be able to make _any_ judgement at all
>>> with a single test on each oil.

>>
>>Umm, I'm less interested in finding a winner than safely extending my
>>OCIs (oil change intervals) to 6,000 or 7,000 miles :-P

>
>And what do you think you will find on a single data point that will tell
>you something that will help this?


Don't be a party-pooper. He's enjoying himself.
Sometimes that's more important than getting answers to life's
imponderable questions.

--Vic
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 06:05 pm   #8 (permalink)
HLS
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles


"Vic Smith" <thismailautodeleted@comcast.net> wrote in message
>
> Don't be a party-pooper. He's enjoying himself.
> Sometimes that's more important than getting answers to life's
> imponderable questions.
>
> --Vic


You can fiddlefart around with these oil analyses as long as you like, but
I am not sure that you get anything as valuable as an oil change would
deliver.

And I am a chemist.

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Old 05 Jul 2009, 07:14 pm   #9 (permalink)
Toyota MDT in MO
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920miles

HLS wrote:
>
> "Vic Smith" <thismailautodeleted@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>
>> Don't be a party-pooper. He's enjoying himself.
>> Sometimes that's more important than getting answers to life's
>> imponderable questions.
>>
>> --Vic

>
> You can fiddlefart around with these oil analyses as long as you like,
> but
> I am not sure that you get anything as valuable as an oil change would
> deliver.
>
> And I am a chemist.

They are very helpful for huge sump capacity engines and machinery, such
as OTR truck engines and stationary generators. For a Camry, I agree :-)

--
Toyota MDT in MO
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Old 05 Jul 2009, 07:21 pm   #10 (permalink)
Scott Dorsey
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Default Re: Used Oil Analysis of CAMRY'S Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 after 4,920 miles

HLS <nospam@nospam.nix> wrote:
>"Vic Smith" <thismailautodeleted@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>
>> Don't be a party-pooper. He's enjoying himself.
>> Sometimes that's more important than getting answers to life's
>> imponderable questions.
>>

>You can fiddlefart around with these oil analyses as long as you like, but
>I am not sure that you get anything as valuable as an oil change would
>deliver.
>
>And I am a chemist.


Well, the oil analysis is a lot like an oil change, in that you can't
just do it once, you have to keep doing it on a regular basis.

What the original poster's analysis tells him is that his engine is
not showing any obvious signs of impending catastrophic failure, his
rings aren't totally shot, his air filter is good, and his oil is
not breaking down. All of these things are things that he could probably
have guessed before doing the analysis.

All a single analysis tells you is that you don't have something horribly
catastrophic wrong. It'll let you know you don't have severe oil breakdown,
and to be honest with ANY motor oil today you won't see severe oil
breakdown after 7,000 miles. This isn't 1970 any longer. The problem
is that what you want to know about your engine is a little bit more
detailed than that.

The problem is that to do long-term oil analyses and keep accurate plots
for years on end is an expensive proposition... much more expensive than
the oil changes you might save. But you can do it if you're inclined to
do such things.

You could buy three identical cars, keep changing the oil on all of them
with a different kind of oil in each, and try and rotate your commute
around all three of them so you put about the same mileage on them. Then
you could do long-term oil analysis on each and five or six years later
probably get a good idea of how each of the oils is doing. I could see
someone doing that.

I mean, I'm the guy who does electrophoresis plates on soy sauce and
titrations on dishwashing detergents so I know which one to buy... but
even I'm not crazy enough to do regular oil analysis...
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
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