89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

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Old 28 Jul 2003, 04:29 pm   #1 (permalink)
MooseMan
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Default 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

We have an 89 4cyl, 5spd, 2wd Camry. On and off for a couple of years it has
had intermittent problem. There seems to be little pattern to it, except it
seems to happen more going up short steep hills. It loses power and
sometimes cuts out/dies or at least is very wimpy for awhile. Then it has a
hard time starting for a few minutes. This can also happen on the straight
level roads. the computer had a TPS trouble code, so swapped that out - got
rid of the code, but no change to performance. We unplugged the O2 sensor,
the car did seem to run much smoother at idle, but no change with the car
dying/lack of power.

As of this last week, the car will no longer start. The engine turns over
but doesn't fire. I have just changed the O2 sensor, and put in another air
flow meter/sensor. No luck. There seems to be spark, and the distributor is
turning. Put in new plugs and fuel filter. Checked fuel pressure at the air
chamber - came squirting out. The computer shows no codes. I would get it
towed to a shop to be scoped, but apparently most scopes need the vehicle
running.....I have run out of ideas, and am desperate for help.
Anyone?
TIA, Andrew


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Old 28 Jul 2003, 05:20 pm   #2 (permalink)
Allen Crawford
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....


"MooseMan" <Moosechips@shaw.ca> wrote in message
newsBgVa.547569$ro6.12471682@news2.calgary.shaw. ca...
> We have an 89 4cyl, 5spd, 2wd Camry. On and off for a couple of years it

has
> had intermittent problem. There seems to be little pattern to it, except

it
> seems to happen more going up short steep hills. It loses power and
> sometimes cuts out/dies or at least is very wimpy for awhile. Then it has

a
> hard time starting for a few minutes. This can also happen on the straight
> level roads. the computer had a TPS trouble code, so swapped that out -

got
> rid of the code, but no change to performance. We unplugged the O2 sensor,
> the car did seem to run much smoother at idle, but no change with the car
> dying/lack of power.
>
> As of this last week, the car will no longer start. The engine turns over
> but doesn't fire. I have just changed the O2 sensor, and put in another

air
> flow meter/sensor. No luck. There seems to be spark, and the distributor

is
> turning. Put in new plugs and fuel filter. Checked fuel pressure at the

air
> chamber - came squirting out. The computer shows no codes. I would get it
> towed to a shop to be scoped, but apparently most scopes need the vehicle
> running.....I have run out of ideas, and am desperate for help.
> Anyone?
> TIA, Andrew
>
>

Just a guess Andrew, but you didn't mention checking timing belt or Coil
output. I would recommend you take your car to the shop after going through
what you mentioned.


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Old 28 Jul 2003, 08:13 pm   #3 (permalink)
MooseMan
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

I had the timing belt changed about 20,000 km ago, and the rotor seems to
line up with TDC. Haven't checked the coil. I'm trying to arrange a tow to a
shop (no Toyota dealers in town) but so far the 2 I've talked to say they
need the car running to put it on the scope.
Thanks
"Allen Crawford" <acrawford1@hot.rr.com> wrote in message
news:ukhVa.117463$TJ.6916451@twister.austin.rr.com ...
>
> "MooseMan" <Moosechips@shaw.ca> wrote in message
> newsBgVa.547569$ro6.12471682@news2.calgary.shaw. ca...
> > We have an 89 4cyl, 5spd, 2wd Camry. On and off for a couple of years it

> has
> > had intermittent problem. There seems to be little pattern to it, except

> it
> > seems to happen more going up short steep hills. It loses power and
> > sometimes cuts out/dies or at least is very wimpy for awhile. Then it

has
> a
> > hard time starting for a few minutes. This can also happen on the

straight
> > level roads. the computer had a TPS trouble code, so swapped that out -

> got
> > rid of the code, but no change to performance. We unplugged the O2

sensor,
> > the car did seem to run much smoother at idle, but no change with the

car
> > dying/lack of power.
> >
> > As of this last week, the car will no longer start. The engine turns

over
> > but doesn't fire. I have just changed the O2 sensor, and put in another

> air
> > flow meter/sensor. No luck. There seems to be spark, and the distributor

> is
> > turning. Put in new plugs and fuel filter. Checked fuel pressure at the

> air
> > chamber - came squirting out. The computer shows no codes. I would get

it
> > towed to a shop to be scoped, but apparently most scopes need the

vehicle
> > running.....I have run out of ideas, and am desperate for help.
> > Anyone?
> > TIA, Andrew
> >
> >

> Just a guess Andrew, but you didn't mention checking timing belt or Coil
> output. I would recommend you take your car to the shop after going

through
> what you mentioned.
>
>



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Old 29 Jul 2003, 11:46 am   #4 (permalink)
Gary Danaher
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

I haven't read the entire thread, but the basics of a running engine are
proper timing, fuel and ignition. If the ignition is likely correct,
pull a plug wire, insert a plug, ground and see if you get a spark, and
if so, the problem is then likely the injection system.

MooseMan wrote:
> I had the timing belt changed about 20,000 km ago, and the rotor seems to
> line up with TDC. Haven't checked the coil. I'm trying to arrange a tow to a
> shop (no Toyota dealers in town) but so far the 2 I've talked to say they
> need the car running to put it on the scope.
> Thanks
> "Allen Crawford" <acrawford1@hot.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:ukhVa.117463$TJ.6916451@twister.austin.rr.com ...
>
>>"MooseMan" <Moosechips@shaw.ca> wrote in message
>>newsBgVa.547569$ro6.12471682@news2.calgary.sha w.ca...
>>
>>>We have an 89 4cyl, 5spd, 2wd Camry. On and off for a couple of years it

>>
>>has
>>
>>>had intermittent problem. There seems to be little pattern to it, except

>>
>>it
>>
>>>seems to happen more going up short steep hills. It loses power and
>>>sometimes cuts out/dies or at least is very wimpy for awhile. Then it

>
> has
>
>>a
>>
>>>hard time starting for a few minutes. This can also happen on the

>
> straight
>
>>>level roads. the computer had a TPS trouble code, so swapped that out -

>>
>>got
>>
>>>rid of the code, but no change to performance. We unplugged the O2

>
> sensor,
>
>>>the car did seem to run much smoother at idle, but no change with the

>
> car
>
>>>dying/lack of power.
>>>
>>>As of this last week, the car will no longer start. The engine turns

>
> over
>
>>>but doesn't fire. I have just changed the O2 sensor, and put in another

>>
>>air
>>
>>>flow meter/sensor. No luck. There seems to be spark, and the distributor

>>
>>is
>>
>>>turning. Put in new plugs and fuel filter. Checked fuel pressure at the

>>
>>air
>>
>>>chamber - came squirting out. The computer shows no codes. I would get

>
> it
>
>>>towed to a shop to be scoped, but apparently most scopes need the

>
> vehicle
>
>>>running.....I have run out of ideas, and am desperate for help.
>>>Anyone?
>>>TIA, Andrew
>>>
>>>

>>
>>Just a guess Andrew, but you didn't mention checking timing belt or Coil
>>output. I would recommend you take your car to the shop after going

>
> through
>
>>what you mentioned.
>>
>>

>
>
>


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Old 29 Jul 2003, 02:39 pm   #5 (permalink)
Jock
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

I was in almost the same situation described, with my 1986 Camry. It
was running fine when we parked it, but a few days later, it refused
to start. It cranked just fine, but never seemed to fire. Things I
tried:
- changed distributor cap, rotor, and plug wires
- saw nice blue spark on each plug pulled out
- measured primary and secondary coil resistance - all within specs
- changed fuel filter (wasn't clogged), plenty of gas
- tested fuel pump by jumpering Fp and B+ connectors, with ignition
on. Sounded ok (I could hear fuel going through lines).
- removed cold start injector; when engine was cranked, it put out
a nice spray of gas
- verified timing belt had not slipped a tooth. When I had the engine
turned to #1 TDC, I was able to look in an inspection port on the
timing belt cover. The port on my car is sealed by a rubber plug
(about 1"); I had to use a mirror and flashlight to see the camshaft
pulley through the port.


I put in a new coil, and surprise, it started right up. In fact it
runs better than it has in years.

Changing the coil is a little tricky. I followed the detailed
directions I found at autozone.com, and pulled out the distributor.
(You could probably change to coil with the distributor in place if
you have a VERY short offset Phillips screwdriver.) Before I removed
the distributor, I set the engine to #1 TDC, and the rotor at #1. I
noted the rotor position, and used masking tape to mark the
distributor timing. With the distributor out, the coil was simple to
replace. Putting the distributor back in correctly was the trick. On
mine, the gear had one tooth marked on the edge closest to the cap.
When I lined that tooth up with a mark on the distributor, and put it
back in the engine, it worked out just fine, with the rotor pointing
the same as when I removed the distributor. I had a shop verify that
the timing was still correct, which I thought was ok, since it was now
running just fine.

Jock
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Old 30 Jul 2003, 12:54 am   #6 (permalink)
MooseMan
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

I've done the same, except check the fuel pump, though there seems to be
lots of pressure at the rail.
I've just ordered a coil - hope that's it......
Thanks for passing on the info.

"Jock" <jsembry@opent.com> wrote in message
news:e4c88b95.0307291139.51f97928@posting.google.c om...
> I was in almost the same situation described, with my 1986 Camry. It
> was running fine when we parked it, but a few days later, it refused
> to start. It cranked just fine, but never seemed to fire. Things I
> tried:
> - changed distributor cap, rotor, and plug wires
> - saw nice blue spark on each plug pulled out
> - measured primary and secondary coil resistance - all within specs
> - changed fuel filter (wasn't clogged), plenty of gas
> - tested fuel pump by jumpering Fp and B+ connectors, with ignition
> on. Sounded ok (I could hear fuel going through lines).
> - removed cold start injector; when engine was cranked, it put out
> a nice spray of gas
> - verified timing belt had not slipped a tooth. When I had the engine
> turned to #1 TDC, I was able to look in an inspection port on the
> timing belt cover. The port on my car is sealed by a rubber plug
> (about 1"); I had to use a mirror and flashlight to see the camshaft
> pulley through the port.
>
>
> I put in a new coil, and surprise, it started right up. In fact it
> runs better than it has in years.
>
> Changing the coil is a little tricky. I followed the detailed
> directions I found at autozone.com, and pulled out the distributor.
> (You could probably change to coil with the distributor in place if
> you have a VERY short offset Phillips screwdriver.) Before I removed
> the distributor, I set the engine to #1 TDC, and the rotor at #1. I
> noted the rotor position, and used masking tape to mark the
> distributor timing. With the distributor out, the coil was simple to
> replace. Putting the distributor back in correctly was the trick. On
> mine, the gear had one tooth marked on the edge closest to the cap.
> When I lined that tooth up with a mark on the distributor, and put it
> back in the engine, it worked out just fine, with the rotor pointing
> the same as when I removed the distributor. I had a shop verify that
> the timing was still correct, which I thought was ok, since it was now
> running just fine.
>
> Jock



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Old 31 Jul 2003, 05:27 am   #7 (permalink)
Tude
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Default Re: 89 Camry - Won't Start - Baffled....

last year, my car refused to start in a couple of mornings. don't know if
it's a coincidence or not, but after I cleaned the grounding contact of a
cylindric capacitor on top of the distributor assembly, the problem
disappeared. drove 40,000 kms since then, and the symptoms never
re-appeared. I hope this helps.

"MooseMan" <Moosechips@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:H4JVa.561795$ro6.12773927@news2.calgary.shaw. ca...
> I've done the same, except check the fuel pump, though there seems to be
> lots of pressure at the rail.
> I've just ordered a coil - hope that's it......
> Thanks for passing on the info.
>
> "Jock" <jsembry@opent.com> wrote in message
> news:e4c88b95.0307291139.51f97928@posting.google.c om...
> > I was in almost the same situation described, with my 1986 Camry. It
> > was running fine when we parked it, but a few days later, it refused
> > to start. It cranked just fine, but never seemed to fire. Things I
> > tried:
> > - changed distributor cap, rotor, and plug wires
> > - saw nice blue spark on each plug pulled out
> > - measured primary and secondary coil resistance - all within specs
> > - changed fuel filter (wasn't clogged), plenty of gas
> > - tested fuel pump by jumpering Fp and B+ connectors, with ignition
> > on. Sounded ok (I could hear fuel going through lines).
> > - removed cold start injector; when engine was cranked, it put out
> > a nice spray of gas
> > - verified timing belt had not slipped a tooth. When I had the engine
> > turned to #1 TDC, I was able to look in an inspection port on the
> > timing belt cover. The port on my car is sealed by a rubber plug
> > (about 1"); I had to use a mirror and flashlight to see the camshaft
> > pulley through the port.
> >
> >
> > I put in a new coil, and surprise, it started right up. In fact it
> > runs better than it has in years.
> >
> > Changing the coil is a little tricky. I followed the detailed
> > directions I found at autozone.com, and pulled out the distributor.
> > (You could probably change to coil with the distributor in place if
> > you have a VERY short offset Phillips screwdriver.) Before I removed
> > the distributor, I set the engine to #1 TDC, and the rotor at #1. I
> > noted the rotor position, and used masking tape to mark the
> > distributor timing. With the distributor out, the coil was simple to
> > replace. Putting the distributor back in correctly was the trick. On
> > mine, the gear had one tooth marked on the edge closest to the cap.
> > When I lined that tooth up with a mark on the distributor, and put it
> > back in the engine, it worked out just fine, with the rotor pointing
> > the same as when I removed the distributor. I had a shop verify that
> > the timing was still correct, which I thought was ok, since it was now
> > running just fine.
> >
> > Jock

>
>



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