timing belt question

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Old 03 Jan 2005, 10:35 am   #1 (permalink)
Sameer Hemchand Jain
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Default timing belt question

hi all,
I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4 clyinder
car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
condition and then tell me what he is going to change.

Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does toyota
recomend?

Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?

Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the mechanic?

thanks a lot
Sameer

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Old 03 Jan 2005, 12:12 pm   #2 (permalink)
Pops
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Default Re: timing belt question

Replacing the water pump is good practice because you are already in the
area anyway. All the same parts have to come off if your pump fails before
the next expected timing belt job. The timing belt also turns the pump. If
the pump fails to turn them the belt fails also causing the engine to stop
rather than just overheat.
No some Mechs may want to inspect the seals inside there also.

Flush is done on the drive to the Mechs. If you want to add the flush
chemicals else new antifreeze is all you will get.

--
Richard N. Price

Popsprice@cfl.rr.com
"Sameer Hemchand Jain" <sjain@saga1.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message
news:Pine.GSO.4.44.0501030827280.22058-100000@saga1.Stanford.EDU...
> hi all,
> I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4 clyinder
> car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
> needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
> also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
> condition and then tell me what he is going to change.
>
> Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does toyota
> recomend?
>
> Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
>
> Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the mechanic?
>
> thanks a lot
> Sameer
>



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Old 03 Jan 2005, 12:44 pm   #3 (permalink)
badgolferman
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Default Re: timing belt question

Sameer Hemchand Jain wrote:
> hi all,
> I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4
> clyinder car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt
> answers on what needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump,
> tensioner and idler also need to be changed, another guy says that he
> will look at the condition and then tell me what he is going to
> change.
>
> Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does
> toyota recomend?
>
> Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
>
> Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the
> mechanic?
>
> thanks a lot
> Sameer


My 94 has 161K miles on it and has had the timing belt replaced twice by
Toyota mechanic. Each time they told me we will look it over and tell
me if the water pump needs replacing. The original pump is still
installed. The tensioner has been replaced each time, but I am not sure
of idler.


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Old 03 Jan 2005, 04:33 pm   #4 (permalink)
twfsa
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Default Re: timing belt question

Whats teh mileage schedule on replaceing the t-belt?

Thanks

Tom


"Sameer Hemchand Jain" <sjain@saga1.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message
news:Pine.GSO.4.44.0501030827280.22058-100000@saga1.Stanford.EDU...
> hi all,
> I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4 clyinder
> car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
> needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
> also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
> condition and then tell me what he is going to change.
>
> Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does toyota
> recomend?
>
> Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
>
> Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the mechanic?
>
> thanks a lot
> Sameer
>



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Old 03 Jan 2005, 05:07 pm   #5 (permalink)
tomcas
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Default Re: timing belt question

Sameer Hemchand Jain wrote:
> hi all,
> I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4 clyinder
> car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
> needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
> also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
> condition and then tell me what he is going to change.
>
> Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does toyota
> recomend?
>
> Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
>
> Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the mechanic?
>
> thanks a lot
> Sameer
>

Do the pump; the additional labor cost is relatively small. If you don't
have the pump replaced, and you need to change the pump later on, the
labor cost is relatively high. Ask the mechanics, they can give you
their standard labor charges both ways. I change my own timing belts on
my cars and I still always change the pump. I don't change the
tensioner, and I change the idler only if it feels rough or loose. Make
sure the pump is a new one, not rebuilt, and preferably an OEM.
Naturally there are exceptions. The pump on my rear drive Corolla is not
buried under the belt so I leave that alone. The pump on my Stanza is
buried so deep behind the belt I wouldn't even think about not replacing
it. In fact itís almost impossible to change the pump without spilling
coolant all over the belt, so they are best done at the same time.
As far as coolant flushes go, I'm starting to think they are a waste of
time.
If you are going to new mechanic it wouldn't hurt to check the BBB.
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Old 04 Jan 2005, 07:42 pm   #6 (permalink)
timbirr@mailcity.com
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Default Re: timing belt question

Changing the pump is a good idea. HOWEVER, be aware that at many
dealers YOU WILL NOT SAVE.

This discussion came up here, oh, about a year ago. A number of us were
blindsided by Toy dealers who went ahead and charged the full shop rate
for changing the pump and belts etc. as if it was the only job being
done, resulting in some shocking service bills.

Yes, they were in there anyway, yes there was no real extra labor
involved, but that did not matter to the "stealership."

So, if you decide to go ahead and have them swap them out at the same
time, make sure you ask if they will charge the fullblown price.

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Old 05 Jan 2005, 04:24 am   #7 (permalink)
Rog
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Default Re: timing belt question

What do you use to hold the crank pulley when you loosen the nut?
If you only use an impact wrench, do you know how much torque it puts out to
be able to loosen it?

"tomcas" <tomcas@mjwebsitedesign.com> wrote in message
news:cnkCd.6513$4x1.537@fe12.lga...
> Sameer Hemchand Jain wrote:
> > hi all,
> > I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4

clyinder
> > car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
> > needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
> > also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
> > condition and then tell me what he is going to change.
> >
> > Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does

toyota
> > recomend?
> >
> > Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
> >
> > Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the

mechanic?
> >
> > thanks a lot
> > Sameer
> >

> Do the pump; the additional labor cost is relatively small. If you don't
> have the pump replaced, and you need to change the pump later on, the
> labor cost is relatively high. Ask the mechanics, they can give you
> their standard labor charges both ways. I change my own timing belts on
> my cars and I still always change the pump. I don't change the
> tensioner, and I change the idler only if it feels rough or loose. Make
> sure the pump is a new one, not rebuilt, and preferably an OEM.
> Naturally there are exceptions. The pump on my rear drive Corolla is not
> buried under the belt so I leave that alone. The pump on my Stanza is
> buried so deep behind the belt I wouldn't even think about not replacing
> it. In fact itís almost impossible to change the pump without spilling
> coolant all over the belt, so they are best done at the same time.
> As far as coolant flushes go, I'm starting to think they are a waste of
> time.
> If you are going to new mechanic it wouldn't hurt to check the BBB.



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Old 05 Jan 2005, 04:25 am   #8 (permalink)
Rog
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Default Re: timing belt question

How do you guys hold the crankshaft pulley when trying to loosen the bolt?
Is an impact wrench enough to loosen it? How much torque is required?

"tomcas" <tomcas@mjwebsitedesign.com> wrote in message
news:cnkCd.6513$4x1.537@fe12.lga...
> Sameer Hemchand Jain wrote:
> > hi all,
> > I am getting the timing belt on my 93 toyota camry changed (4

clyinder
> > car). I asked around at different shops and get differnt answers on what
> > needs to be done. One guy says that the water pump, tensioner and idler
> > also need to be changed, another guy says that he will look at the
> > condition and then tell me what he is going to change.
> >
> > Could someone give me an idea of what is typically done/ what does

toyota
> > recomend?
> >
> > Also is a coolant flush done at the same time?
> >
> > Are there any other things I should check before deciding on the

mechanic?
> >
> > thanks a lot
> > Sameer
> >

> Do the pump; the additional labor cost is relatively small. If you don't
> have the pump replaced, and you need to change the pump later on, the
> labor cost is relatively high. Ask the mechanics, they can give you
> their standard labor charges both ways. I change my own timing belts on
> my cars and I still always change the pump. I don't change the
> tensioner, and I change the idler only if it feels rough or loose. Make
> sure the pump is a new one, not rebuilt, and preferably an OEM.
> Naturally there are exceptions. The pump on my rear drive Corolla is not
> buried under the belt so I leave that alone. The pump on my Stanza is
> buried so deep behind the belt I wouldn't even think about not replacing
> it. In fact itís almost impossible to change the pump without spilling
> coolant all over the belt, so they are best done at the same time.
> As far as coolant flushes go, I'm starting to think they are a waste of
> time.
> If you are going to new mechanic it wouldn't hurt to check the BBB.



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Old 05 Jan 2005, 05:39 am   #9 (permalink)
Geoff
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Default Re: timing belt question

I hired the biggest, baddest 3/4" drive impact wrench I could find, and it
was not enough to loosen this bolt.

On some engines there is an accessible cover plate at the other end of the
engine, which you can remove to then wedge the flywheel or drive plate from
turning. On my engine it was not present.

Eventually I placed the socket hard on the bolt head, with a long breaker
bar (actually a piece of water pipe) resting on the concrete floor, and hit
the starter. This is pure butchery, and *terrible* for the starter motor
and the ring gear, but I got away with it. The risk is that you can break a
tooth on the ring gear.

When I took out the bolt, I saw that it had been assembled with loctite.

I installed it afterward with the impact wrench and loctite again. The
impact wrench spec happened to be about the same as the specified torque
(216 Nm or about 160 ft-lb)

Geoff

"Rog" <anon@blog.com> wrote in message news:RgPCd.331068$HA.873@attbi_s01...
> How do you guys hold the crankshaft pulley when trying to loosen the bolt?
> Is an impact wrench enough to loosen it? How much torque is required?
>



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Old 05 Jan 2005, 07:26 am   #10 (permalink)
Daniel
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Default Re: timing belt question

My experience is with the 4 cylinder. Torque value is only around 80
ft. lbs.
Understand the six cylinder crank bolts can be extremely tight.
Fortunately, an inexpensive electric impact wrench was enough to easily
loosen the bolt without even moving the pulley - very nice as timing
marks stayed aligned; bolt just spun right off.
Same for installation. Used the electric impact wrench. Had a problem
where I had to remove it again, and it came off again, no problem, yet
the impact feature tightens it enough where I'm not concerned about the
bolt working loose. Bottom line - just estimating torque on tightening.

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