99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

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Old 28 Jan 2005, 10:40 am   #1 (permalink)
Funky McCool14
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Default 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

Hey,

I have a 99 Camry with the 4 cylinder and auto tranny with 105,000
miles. I got the car with 95K and had the transmission flushed by a
shop which connected one of those machines which replaced the fluid
while it was running - the fluid which came out was dark and by the
time the flush was complete, the fluid was nice and red the way it
should be. That was over a year ago - no problems.

Now the east coast has gotten some really nasty cold weather, and the
transmission doesn't like it. Today I backed out of my spot (car was
parked on a slant, side to side on a hill) OK, but when I went to put
the car in drive (I let the engine warm up so the needle had moved
above the bottom-most line) and attempted to go up a slight incline, I
could tell she wasn't going to make it, (slippage) so I backed down
where the car was level. Attempts to go forward and backward failed.
I put the car in park, popped the hood, and checked the fluid level.
It appeared a little low (probably because it's so darn cold) so I
added about 4 oz. (a very small amount - the new ATF fluid out of the
quart container was like 20w oil it was so cold) and then by the time
I put the stuff away, the tranny was working again OK. My thought was
that the car was parked tilted, and the tranny oil being so cold,
perhaps was having some trouble getting circulated. Once the car was
level and warmed up some more, it was fine.

I have done some reading here and it appears that seals may be the
cause of this slippage.

Apparently if I let it warm up enough, the problem goes away - and a
few extra minutes waiting for the car to warm up sure seems worth it
compared to a $1500 - 2000 transmission rebuild (guessing on cost).

Think it would be a good idea to put in synthetic tranny fluid?

Comments? Advice?

Thanks!
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Old 28 Jan 2005, 11:05 am   #2 (permalink)
badgolferman
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

Funky McCool14 wrote:
> Hey,
>
> I have a 99 Camry with the 4 cylinder and auto tranny with 105,000
> miles. I got the car with 95K and had the transmission flushed by a
> shop which connected one of those machines which replaced the fluid
> while it was running - the fluid which came out was dark and by the
> time the flush was complete, the fluid was nice and red the way it
> should be. That was over a year ago - no problems.
>
> Now the east coast has gotten some really nasty cold weather, and the
> transmission doesn't like it. Today I backed out of my spot (car was
> parked on a slant, side to side on a hill) OK, but when I went to put
> the car in drive (I let the engine warm up so the needle had moved
> above the bottom-most line) and attempted to go up a slight incline, I
> could tell she wasn't going to make it, (slippage) so I backed down
> where the car was level. Attempts to go forward and backward failed.
> I put the car in park, popped the hood, and checked the fluid level.
> It appeared a little low (probably because it's so darn cold) so I
> added about 4 oz. (a very small amount - the new ATF fluid out of the
> quart container was like 20w oil it was so cold) and then by the time
> I put the stuff away, the tranny was working again OK. My thought was
> that the car was parked tilted, and the tranny oil being so cold,
> perhaps was having some trouble getting circulated. Once the car was
> level and warmed up some more, it was fine.
>
> I have done some reading here and it appears that seals may be the
> cause of this slippage.
>
> Apparently if I let it warm up enough, the problem goes away - and a
> few extra minutes waiting for the car to warm up sure seems worth it
> compared to a $1500 - 2000 transmission rebuild (guessing on cost).
>
> Think it would be a good idea to put in synthetic tranny fluid?
>
> Comments? Advice?
>
> Thanks!


Just a comment. My 1994 4 cyl with 162K is exhibiting some of the same
symptoms. For me when it is cold the car sometimes makes quick hard
shifts from first to second or feels like it is slipping a bit from a
dead stop. These symptoms all go away when the fluids have warmed up.
I am not sure if letting the car warm up before hand is helping it or
not. I think it has done it then also but I can't quite remember.

I've been told by many mechanics including the Toyota guy that flushing
the transmission with high mileage if it has not been done a few times
in the past is not a good idea. Some say leave it as it is and others
say just drain and refill. I am not qualified to make that assesment.

My 1997 Camry 4 cyl with 102K was having shifting into overdrive
problems around 75K. A complete flush took care of that problem and it
works smoothly since.


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Old 28 Jan 2005, 11:07 am   #3 (permalink)
m Ransley
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

I would change the oil again, did you do the filter last time? Ive heard
those flushes can be bad. Check your oil after it is warm now, you may
have overfilled it, last time that happened to me at 10ff the level went
way off temporarily. If it happens again put car in idle and let it warm
more, when it happened to me I smelt burning because I tried to force
the car forward, obviously the oil wasnt getting somewhere. I went to
Mobil synthetic and this year has been fine even today at zero. Also
your differential and power steering take ATF , good time to change all
three [if your differential is separate] mine is a 90 so check , your
fluid requirements may be different. Your oil may look clean as mine was
only 7000 old but a new filter and oil made a big difference.

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Old 28 Jan 2005, 11:57 am   #4 (permalink)
Philip
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

Funky McCool14 wrote:
> Hey,
>
> I have a 99 Camry with the 4 cylinder and auto tranny with 105,000
> miles.
>snip
> Attempts to go forward and backward failed.
> I put the car in park, popped the hood, and checked the fluid level.
>
> Thanks!


Just have to ask the obvious question: You ARE checking the fluid level
with the engine RUNNING and the selector in PARK ... right?
--

~Philip.


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Old 28 Jan 2005, 12:11 pm   #5 (permalink)
Funky McCool14
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 17:57:41 GMT, "Philip"
<1chip-state1@earthlink.n0t> wrote:

>Funky McCool14 wrote:
>> Hey,
>>
>> I have a 99 Camry with the 4 cylinder and auto tranny with 105,000
>> miles.
>>snip
>> Attempts to go forward and backward failed.
>> I put the car in park, popped the hood, and checked the fluid level.
>>
>> Thanks!

>
>Just have to ask the obvious question: You ARE checking the fluid level
>with the engine RUNNING and the selector in PARK ... right?


You bet.

Of course, to properly check fluid, it should be done when the tranny
is at operating temp, and the only way to get that fluid up to
operating temp on a morning like this morning would have been to drive
the car for a good 5 miles, maybe more.

The tranny flush places don't touch the pan any more, so the filter
(it may be a strainer) has not been touched since I got the car last
year.

I like the idea of a synthetic ATF - but the only way to really make
sure the old fluid is swapped out with new is to take in syth to a
flush/exhange place and ask them to use my ATF, or set up some
home-made fluid exchange contraption - something I do not want to do
considering the outside temps, plus the fact I live in an apartment
building and they don't take kindly to tenants who make fluid messes
with their cars! :-)

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Old 28 Jan 2005, 12:34 pm   #6 (permalink)
Hachiroku
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather


"badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:35v9m9F4pbo78U1@individual.net...
> Funky McCool14 wrote:
> > Hey,
> >
> > I have a 99 Camry with the 4 cylinder and auto tranny with 105,000
> > miles. I got the car with 95K and had the transmission flushed by a
> > shop which connected one of those machines which replaced the fluid
> > while it was running - the fluid which came out was dark and by the
> > time the flush was complete, the fluid was nice and red the way it
> > should be. That was over a year ago - no problems.
> >
> > Now the east coast has gotten some really nasty cold weather, and the
> > transmission doesn't like it. Today I backed out of my spot (car was
> > parked on a slant, side to side on a hill) OK, but when I went to put
> > the car in drive (I let the engine warm up so the needle had moved
> > above the bottom-most line) and attempted to go up a slight incline, I
> > could tell she wasn't going to make it, (slippage) so I backed down
> > where the car was level. Attempts to go forward and backward failed.
> > I put the car in park, popped the hood, and checked the fluid level.
> > It appeared a little low (probably because it's so darn cold) so I
> > added about 4 oz. (a very small amount - the new ATF fluid out of the
> > quart container was like 20w oil it was so cold) and then by the time
> > I put the stuff away, the tranny was working again OK. My thought was
> > that the car was parked tilted, and the tranny oil being so cold,
> > perhaps was having some trouble getting circulated. Once the car was
> > level and warmed up some more, it was fine.
> >
> > I have done some reading here and it appears that seals may be the
> > cause of this slippage.
> >
> > Apparently if I let it warm up enough, the problem goes away - and a
> > few extra minutes waiting for the car to warm up sure seems worth it
> > compared to a $1500 - 2000 transmission rebuild (guessing on cost).
> >
> > Think it would be a good idea to put in synthetic tranny fluid?
> >
> > Comments? Advice?
> >
> > Thanks!

>
> Just a comment. My 1994 4 cyl with 162K is exhibiting some of the same
> symptoms. For me when it is cold the car sometimes makes quick hard
> shifts from first to second or feels like it is slipping a bit from a
> dead stop. These symptoms all go away when the fluids have warmed up.
> I am not sure if letting the car warm up before hand is helping it or
> not. I think it has done it then also but I can't quite remember.
>
> I've been told by many mechanics including the Toyota guy that flushing
> the transmission with high mileage if it has not been done a few times
> in the past is not a good idea. Some say leave it as it is and others
> say just drain and refill. I am not qualified to make that assesment.


We've had three cars so far that bit the big one after having the tranny
flushed; all over 100,000 miles. I think the OP lucked out, esp since he
said the fluid was black! (Black is generally a sign the clutch packs are
shot out and the tranny is starrting to chew on the metal pieces (Why can't
I remember what they're called?)

I wouldn't do it unless it was a brand new car and have the service done no
further apart than 50,000 miles.

I talked to one of the shops we use at our dealership, and he said they use
a base Dextron/Mercon II fluid with the proper 'modifiers' added. I don't
think I'll be bringing my Chrysler there any time soon...

>
> My 1997 Camry 4 cyl with 102K was having shifting into overdrive
> problems around 75K. A complete flush took care of that problem and it
> works smoothly since.
>
>



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Old 28 Jan 2005, 01:37 pm   #7 (permalink)
m Ransley
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

On a cold day 5 miles wont warm the trans, the motor yes, but the trans
takes alot more time to warm up. You are better off change filter and
oil not flushing it and use the drain plug to drain out more in 2-3000.
You do not know if small contaminents are actualy introduced through
their flushing from dirty equipment. There are also magnets in the pan
that need to be cleaned , flushing may actualy move dirt around. A bad
filter will cause problems like you are having. I see flushing as a shop
money maker only.

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Old 28 Jan 2005, 04:30 pm   #8 (permalink)
Funky McCool14
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 13:37:46 -0600, ransley@webtv.net (m Ransley)
wrote:

The first fluid exchange (not flush) on this particular car was done
over a year ago and about 10K miles with no ill effect. This recent
slipppage seems to be caused by the extremely cold weather we've been
having.

However I do agree with you. My resources are somewhat limited for me
to do more than just pull the drain plug. I could drop the pan to see
if there is a filter in there for changing, but from what I have read,
the slippage due to cold is caused by seals.

My thought was to exchange the fluid with synthetic as that may fair
better in the frigid temps we've been seeing.

Otherwise the fix is to just sit until the car warms up more. Not
that I had a choice this morning! :-)


>On a cold day 5 miles wont warm the trans, the motor yes, but the trans
>takes alot more time to warm up. You are better off change filter and
>oil not flushing it and use the drain plug to drain out more in 2-3000.
>You do not know if small contaminents are actualy introduced through
>their flushing from dirty equipment. There are also magnets in the pan
>that need to be cleaned , flushing may actualy move dirt around. A bad
>filter will cause problems like you are having. I see flushing as a shop
>money maker only.


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Old 28 Jan 2005, 05:31 pm   #9 (permalink)
m Ransley
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

Pullng the pan is not DIY unless you have a lift, Midas pulled my pan
for 20 and put on a new filter and oil , I brought the filter and
synthetic oil. A clogged filter may be it, dont just wait , you realy
should do it now or more damage will occur if it is the filter.

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Old 28 Jan 2005, 05:36 pm   #10 (permalink)
Philip
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Default Re: 99 Camry Tranny Slip in super cold weather

SINCE 99% of automatic transmissions have a coolant/oil heat EXCHANGER, the
transmission temperature follows engine temperature but at a somewhat lower
temperature. Yes, the 'exchanger' HEATS the transmission fluid. 5 miles is
plenty to bring up the trans to near engine temperature. Why "near engine
temperature?" Because the coolant exiting the radiator is less than
thermostat set temperature.
--

~Philip.


m Ransley wrote:
> On a cold day 5 miles wont warm the trans, the motor yes, but the
> trans takes alot more time to warm up. You are better off change
> filter and oil not flushing it and use the drain plug to drain out
> more in 2-3000. You do not know if small contaminents are actualy
> introduced through their flushing from dirty equipment. There are
> also magnets in the pan that need to be cleaned , flushing may
> actualy move dirt around. A bad filter will cause problems like you
> are having. I see flushing as a shop money maker only.



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