Manual vs Automatic

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Old 02 Apr 2005, 01:45 pm   #1 (permalink)
Ed
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Default Manual vs Automatic

I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
someone with first hand experience....???

-Ed-
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Old 03 Apr 2005, 08:28 am   #2 (permalink)
Hopkins
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic

Know any mechanics you can ask?

I haven't heard of any problems with Toy manuals. The info in the
following link may be out of date, but it's interesting nonetheless...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04345/424551.stm

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Old 03 Apr 2005, 09:10 am   #3 (permalink)
Jason James
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic


"Ed" <nflanders88@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:fjtt4159q95nlgi9qs52rd0pe6dupvf9br@4ax.com...
> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
> someone with first hand experience....???
>
> -Ed-



With all due respect to your sources,..they are wrong. The Camry manual
transmission is an easy car to drive because the engine has good low-down
torque which limits the possibility of engine stalls. They are really an
excellent car for a stick-shift compared to an engine which lives on revs.

Jason


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Old 05 Apr 2005, 06:37 am   #4 (permalink)
Bogdan Iamandei
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic

On 2005-04-03, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
>
> "Ed" <nflanders88@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:fjtt4159q95nlgi9qs52rd0pe6dupvf9br@4ax.com...
>> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
>> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
>> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
>> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
>> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
>> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
>> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
>> someone with first hand experience....???
>>
>> -Ed-

>
>
> With all due respect to your sources,..they are wrong. The Camry manual
> transmission is an easy car to drive because the engine has good low-down
> torque which limits the possibility of engine stalls. They are really an
> excellent car for a stick-shift compared to an engine which lives on revs.


As a manual Camry owner, I whole-heartedly agree. The car's got a really
good gearbox and you can't go wrong choosing a manual. The other
advantage is that it's less complexity embeded in the car, hence, less
things likely to break in wondrous *new* ways.

No, really, if you can chase for a manual (mine took me 6 months to find
it) by all means do it. It's a good ride and you'll enjoy it.

The other thing, depending on what how many cylinders you get, you'll
get better mileage out of it. Mine's a 99 model, and I routinely get
8.3l/100km mixed traffic. If I use BP Ultimate, it drops to 7.3/100km.

Ino!~

--
I have seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire
off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark
near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time,
like tears in rain. Time to die.
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Old 05 Apr 2005, 02:47 pm   #5 (permalink)
Jason James
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic


"Bogdan Iamandei" <chilia@wziejxwoa.jap> wrote in message
news:4252788f$0$12159$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...
> On 2005-04-03, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
> >
> > "Ed" <nflanders88@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:fjtt4159q95nlgi9qs52rd0pe6dupvf9br@4ax.com...
> >> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
> >> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
> >> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
> >> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
> >> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
> >> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
> >> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
> >> someone with first hand experience....???
> >>
> >> -Ed-

> >
> >
> > With all due respect to your sources,..they are wrong. The Camry manual
> > transmission is an easy car to drive because the engine has good

low-down
> > torque which limits the possibility of engine stalls. They are really an
> > excellent car for a stick-shift compared to an engine which lives on

revs.
>
> As a manual Camry owner, I whole-heartedly agree. The car's got a really
> good gearbox and you can't go wrong choosing a manual. The other
> advantage is that it's less complexity embeded in the car, hence, less
> things likely to break in wondrous *new* ways.
>
> No, really, if you can chase for a manual (mine took me 6 months to find
> it) by all means do it. It's a good ride and you'll enjoy it.
>
> The other thing, depending on what how many cylinders you get, you'll
> get better mileage out of it. Mine's a 99 model, and I routinely get
> 8.3l/100km mixed traffic. If I use BP Ultimate, it drops to 7.3/100km.
>
> Ino!~


I get about 10L/100ks in my '96 4 cyl around town. Out on the hiway it drops
to 8/100k. Not as good as yours, but my engine was oil-change abused at one
stage by the original owners (2 of) as there is tar residue inside the
motor. I haven't tried higher octane fuel. My figs are on std
unleaded,...about 92 RON.

Do find yours pulls away from low speed in 3rd gear without any fuss or
laboring? I stopped going back to 2nd gear for exiting corners around town
after I noticed it would do it in 3rd, with a light throttle, without drama.

Jason


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Old 05 Apr 2005, 10:23 pm   #6 (permalink)
hachiroku
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic

On Sat, 02 Apr 2005 19:45:56 +0000, Ed wrote:

> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
> someone with first hand experience....???
>
> -Ed-


If you can shift a 5-speed, do it! I haven't personally had trouble with
Toy automatics, but the Supra I bought in Nov needs a new tranny or a
rebuild. I have mostly owned 5 speeds and haven't had to do ANYTHING to
them but keep them filled up! I have two over 250,000 still on the
original clutches!!!
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Old 06 Apr 2005, 05:08 am   #7 (permalink)
Bogdan Iamandei
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic

On 2005-04-05, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
>
> "Bogdan Iamandei" <chilia@wziejxwoa.jap> wrote in message
> news:4252788f$0$12159$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...
>> On 2005-04-03, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
>> >
>> > "Ed" <nflanders88@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> > news:fjtt4159q95nlgi9qs52rd0pe6dupvf9br@4ax.com...
>> >> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
>> >> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
>> >> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
>> >> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
>> >> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
>> >> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick is
>> >> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
>> >> someone with first hand experience....???
>> >>
>> >> -Ed-
>> >
>> >
>> > With all due respect to your sources,..they are wrong. The Camry manual
>> > transmission is an easy car to drive because the engine has good

> low-down
>> > torque which limits the possibility of engine stalls. They are really an
>> > excellent car for a stick-shift compared to an engine which lives on

> revs.
>>
>> As a manual Camry owner, I whole-heartedly agree. The car's got a really
>> good gearbox and you can't go wrong choosing a manual. The other
>> advantage is that it's less complexity embeded in the car, hence, less
>> things likely to break in wondrous *new* ways.
>>
>> No, really, if you can chase for a manual (mine took me 6 months to find
>> it) by all means do it. It's a good ride and you'll enjoy it.
>>
>> The other thing, depending on what how many cylinders you get, you'll
>> get better mileage out of it. Mine's a 99 model, and I routinely get
>> 8.3l/100km mixed traffic. If I use BP Ultimate, it drops to 7.3/100km.
>>
>> Ino!~

>
> I get about 10L/100ks in my '96 4 cyl around town. Out on the hiway it drops
> to 8/100k. Not as good as yours, but my engine was oil-change abused at one
> stage by the original owners (2 of) as there is tar residue inside the
> motor. I haven't tried higher octane fuel. My figs are on std
> unleaded,...about 92 RON.


At this point I'm running it on 92 as well. 98 RON is *WAY* to expensive
these days. So expensive that if 92RON goes over $1.10 routinely, I'm even
considering starting to work at the other location of my employer. Which
location's about 4Km away compared to about 40Km away the one where I'm
going now.


> Do find yours pulls away from low speed in 3rd gear without any fuss or
> laboring? I stopped going back to 2nd gear for exiting corners around town
> after I noticed it would do it in 3rd, with a light throttle, without drama.


I'm not sure what are the differences between the cars (weight, power,
gearbox ratios). Mine's pretty allright in 3rd, but then there are some
really tight round-abouts where I drive so I normally drop it into
second if I feel I need to. The other thing is that when/if you have
the money, put a few tanks (around 3-4) of 98RON in it. From the first
tank you'll notice *LOADS* of responsivness (and loads less $ in your
pocket too, but life's like that). The engine is also much quieter.
Mine, as soon as I filled, I pulled in the parking lot next to the pump
to write down the mileage. While doing it, it took some time and I
forgot whether I had the engine on or off, but with the radio on, not
loud at all I couldn't hear the damned thing, so I had to turn off the
radio just to hear the engine running. Looking back I could've looked
at the RPM indicator, but noise or the lack thereof struck me as the
first thing.

Anyways, back to gears, I found third to cater to most of my needs,
but then again - I am using quite a lot of the car's inertia as well
so I'm helping it a lot too. I presume you're doing pretty much the
same, whether knowingly or not.

Ino!~

--
I have seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire
off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark
near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time,
like tears in rain. Time to die.
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Old 06 Apr 2005, 02:22 pm   #8 (permalink)
Jason James
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic


"Bogdan Iamandei" <chilia@wziejxwoa.jap> wrote in message
news:4253b520$0$5396$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au ...
> On 2005-04-05, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
> >
> > "Bogdan Iamandei" <chilia@wziejxwoa.jap> wrote in message
> > news:4252788f$0$12159$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...
> >> On 2005-04-03, Jason James <associate@dodo.comzapspam.au> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > "Ed" <nflanders88@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> > news:fjtt4159q95nlgi9qs52rd0pe6dupvf9br@4ax.com...
> >> >> I am looking to purchase a 2005 Toyota Camary and would like to
> >> >> purchase one with a manual transmission. I know they're a little
> >> >> difficult to find but I have never had an automatic car and I don't
> >> >> wish to start now. Plain and simple, I enjoy driving "stick". My
> >> >> dilemma is that some people have told me that the Camry was really
> >> >> designed to have an automatic transmission and getting one in stick

is
> >> >> only asking for trouble. Not sure if I buy that. Any advice from
> >> >> someone with first hand experience....???
> >> >>
> >> >> -Ed-
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > With all due respect to your sources,..they are wrong. The Camry

manual
> >> > transmission is an easy car to drive because the engine has good

> > low-down
> >> > torque which limits the possibility of engine stalls. They are really

an
> >> > excellent car for a stick-shift compared to an engine which lives on

> > revs.
> >>
> >> As a manual Camry owner, I whole-heartedly agree. The car's got a

really
> >> good gearbox and you can't go wrong choosing a manual. The other
> >> advantage is that it's less complexity embeded in the car, hence, less
> >> things likely to break in wondrous *new* ways.
> >>
> >> No, really, if you can chase for a manual (mine took me 6 months to

find
> >> it) by all means do it. It's a good ride and you'll enjoy it.
> >>
> >> The other thing, depending on what how many cylinders you get, you'll
> >> get better mileage out of it. Mine's a 99 model, and I routinely get
> >> 8.3l/100km mixed traffic. If I use BP Ultimate, it drops to 7.3/100km.
> >>
> >> Ino!~

> >
> > I get about 10L/100ks in my '96 4 cyl around town. Out on the hiway it

drops
> > to 8/100k. Not as good as yours, but my engine was oil-change abused at

one
> > stage by the original owners (2 of) as there is tar residue inside the
> > motor. I haven't tried higher octane fuel. My figs are on std
> > unleaded,...about 92 RON.

>
> At this point I'm running it on 92 as well. 98 RON is *WAY* to expensive
> these days. So expensive that if 92RON goes over $1.10 routinely, I'm even
> considering starting to work at the other location of my employer. Which
> location's about 4Km away compared to about 40Km away the one where I'm
> going now.
>
>
> > Do find yours pulls away from low speed in 3rd gear without any fuss or
> > laboring? I stopped going back to 2nd gear for exiting corners around

town
> > after I noticed it would do it in 3rd, with a light throttle, without

drama.
>
> I'm not sure what are the differences between the cars (weight, power,
> gearbox ratios). Mine's pretty allright in 3rd, but then there are some
> really tight round-abouts where I drive so I normally drop it into
> second if I feel I need to.


Yeah,..roundabouts tend to operate on everyone using brisk acceleration. I
use 2nd for most of those.


The other thing is that when/if you have
> the money, put a few tanks (around 3-4) of 98RON in it. From the first
> tank you'll notice *LOADS* of responsivness (and loads less $ in your
> pocket too, but life's like that). The engine is also much quieter.
> Mine, as soon as I filled, I pulled in the parking lot next to the pump
> to write down the mileage. While doing it, it took some time and I
> forgot whether I had the engine on or off, but with the radio on, not
> loud at all I couldn't hear the damned thing, so I had to turn off the
> radio just to hear the engine running. Looking back I could've looked
> at the RPM indicator, but noise or the lack thereof struck me as the
> first thing.


Once again mines a little noisy at idle. I've resigned myself to the fact it
probably wont produce the phenomonal longevity these motors can do.


> Anyways, back to gears, I found third to cater to most of my needs,
> but then again - I am using quite a lot of the car's inertia as well
> so I'm helping it a lot too. I presume you're doing pretty much the
> same, whether knowingly or not.
>
> Ino!~


Too true. I meant corners where you have a clear run at and the car is
already doing at least 30kph as you exit. Any slower and 3rd is too tall for
a reasonabley speedy exit.

Jason


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Old 06 Apr 2005, 03:36 pm   #9 (permalink)
Daniel
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Default Re: Manual vs Automatic

The other thing is that when/if you have
the money, put a few tanks (around 3-4) of 98RON in it. From the first
tank you'll notice *LOADS* of responsivness (and loads less $ in your
pocket too, but life's like that). The engine is also much quieter.
---------------------
This is the first time I've ever heard this.
Is is possible your engine has some carbon build up in the cylinders/
heads/ or valves?
For the six cylinder, higher octane rating is recommended for "optimum
performance", but for the four cylinder, no such indication of any
benefit according to the Owner's manual.
General consensus of opinon has always been that higher octane ratings
in the four cylinder engine are just waste of money with no benefit.
That's why I wonder if your engine had enough internal carbon deposits
to create a difference for you.
Compression ratio on the four is 9.5:1. Generally fuel octane rating is
selected based on CR, higher octane burning more slowly to match engine
characteristics.

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