1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10 Sep 2005, 04:46 pm   #1 (permalink)
Bohol B via CarKB.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

I took my 99 Camry in for a maintenance tune-up and the shop manager later
called me and advised that the valve cover gasket and tube seals had to be
replaced (additional $110).

Earlier, I had instructed him to hold the spark plugs that were being
replaced so I could examine them. He showed me one plug that appeared to
have oil on the stem, but the tip and gap appeared almost identical to the
remaining three plugs. All four plugs appeared normal and I don't understand
why the valve cover gasket and tube seals would need to be replaced. When he
called me to tell me that the gasket and seal would need to be replaced, he
said it was because they were damaged but after I looked at the gasket and
the seals, they did not appear to be damaged. When I pressed further for the
reason when I went to pick the car up, he said it was for preventive
maintenance. Has anyone experienced this before?
  Reply With Quote
Old 11 Sep 2005, 08:23 am   #2 (permalink)
Wayne55dud@aol.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

When he says "preventive maintenance," he means he needs it on his
boat, courtesy of ripping you off.

  Reply With Quote
Old 11 Sep 2005, 09:00 am   #3 (permalink)
Daniel
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

I'm at a bit of a loss when discussing service with someone who does
not do their own work.
I've had a litany of complaints stretching back for years nearly every
single time I have had a mechanic do anything to any number of
different make and model vehicles, although, in general, some of the
dealers have done a better job.
Once a GM dealer service department replaced a defective diode in a
rebuilt alternator I had installed and that was impressive, but the
local Toyota service department stripped a distributor hold down bolt
and then denied it --- and the list goes on -- much longer.
But back to your question.
Valve cover gasket and tube seals for preventative maintenance? Sure,
I've replaced them, and plan to replace them at every major service
interval when I replace the timing belt.
Here's a simple example of the benefits of doing my own work --
recently spent as much for tools as I would have for Toyota service,
but discovered when changing the right front axle assembly that the
prior mechanic had neglected to replace the bearing lock bolt, and
since the local dealer whom I was considering have do the work hadn't
ordered one either, I can only assume it would have been missed again
even though the factory service manual list this as a "non reusable
part" - and with good reason - the tip is neoprene, and when I removed
the old bolt - the tip that actually locks the bearing rotation, was
missing. Now I have the tools to change the ball joints, struts,
springs, axles, etc., and was able to inspect them as well. Plus using
the full polish high torque air gun with the 30mm impact socket for the
axle nut was fun and effortless once I learned how to hold it properly
and let it do the work.
So, when you're dealing with dealers and their service department
writers you'll have to decide for yourself.
Personally, I'm not sure it's worth it.
The standard procedure is to buy a car and replace it every few years.
I'm convinced that one reason cars need periodic replacement is that
mechanics under time pressure make little shortcomings that accumulate
over time.
If you could find a good mechanic or learn to do your own work, where
you take the time to clean and examine each assembly as you go, with
the pride of workmanship that derives from servicing your own vehicle,
your Toyota can last virtually indefinitely. Case in point: my 1977
Toyota pick up truck still operates flawlessly, and the 1994 Camry is
as clean under the car as when new. Not a drop of oil anywhere, but . .
.. I've learned to replace all those oil seals your dealer is describing
to you - plus many others, as a part of routine maintenance.
If you do not replace oil seals, the car will still run.
Once had a VW (in college) where I decided to rebuild the engine when
it started using a quart a week - still ran fine though.
Same with your Camry. Most people just let the oil leaks accumulate,
rather than pay the cost of fixing them, then eventually replace the
car.
If you learn to enjoy doing your own mechanical work, then the cost of
oil seals is minimal, usually only a few dollars apiece.

  Reply With Quote
Old 11 Sep 2005, 07:38 pm   #4 (permalink)
johngdole@hotmail.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

Excellent advice. The valve cover gasket and tube seals cost about $14.
Fel-Pro VS50304R ($13.54 on rockauto.com).

It's a good idea to replace these seals as Daniel mentioned. You do
have to have some tools (such as the large spark plug tube socket) and
a small amount of sensor safe RTV (a tube costs $4) to install this
set.

The problem is not whether or not this should be replaced but the
changing excuses your dealer is giving you.

So consider picking up a Haynes/Chilton repair manual and think about
doing it yourself.

  Reply With Quote
Old 17 Sep 2005, 10:58 pm   #5 (permalink)
Bohol B via CarKB.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

Thanks for the advice. I have picked up a Haynes manual and will try to do
some of the maintenance stuff myself. In the meantime, I will file a
complaint with the local Better Business Bureau. I probably won't benefit
from it, but hopefully if there are enough complaints about this shop it will
lead to reduced business for them.

johngdole@hotmail.com wrote:
>Excellent advice. The valve cover gasket and tube seals cost about $14.
>Fel-Pro VS50304R ($13.54 on rockauto.com).
>
>It's a good idea to replace these seals as Daniel mentioned. You do
>have to have some tools (such as the large spark plug tube socket) and
>a small amount of sensor safe RTV (a tube costs $4) to install this
>set.
>
>The problem is not whether or not this should be replaced but the
>changing excuses your dealer is giving you.
>
>So consider picking up a Haynes/Chilton repair manual and think about
>doing it yourself.



--
Message posted via http://www.carkb.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 17 Sep 2005, 10:59 pm   #6 (permalink)
Bohol B via CarKB.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

That's how I felt after I left that shop and I will never return there.

Wayne55dud@aol.com wrote:
>When he says "preventive maintenance," he means he needs it on his
>boat, courtesy of ripping you off.



--
Message posted via CarKB.com
http://www.carkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx...camry/200509/1
  Reply With Quote
Old 17 Sep 2005, 11:12 pm   #7 (permalink)
Bohol B via CarKB.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

Your comments just brought up some other interesting points. This same shop
replaced my timing belt a few months ago, and if replacing the gasket is
normal during that type of service, then they should have already replaced
the gasket then. I'll have to check my receipt to see the work detail that
was done back when the timing belt was replaced.

I was told that the seals automatically come with the gasket when you get the
part and that was the rationale behind changing the gasket as well. It
infuriates me, because I feel that I was charged for doing something that
didn't really need to be done!!!!


Daniel wrote:
>I'm at a bit of a loss when discussing service with someone who does
>not do their own work.
>I've had a litany of complaints stretching back for years nearly every
>single time I have had a mechanic do anything to any number of
>different make and model vehicles, although, in general, some of the
>dealers have done a better job.
>Once a GM dealer service department replaced a defective diode in a
>rebuilt alternator I had installed and that was impressive, but the
>local Toyota service department stripped a distributor hold down bolt
>and then denied it --- and the list goes on -- much longer.
>But back to your question.
>Valve cover gasket and tube seals for preventative maintenance? Sure,
>I've replaced them, and plan to replace them at every major service
>interval when I replace the timing belt.
>Here's a simple example of the benefits of doing my own work --
>recently spent as much for tools as I would have for Toyota service,
>but discovered when changing the right front axle assembly that the
>prior mechanic had neglected to replace the bearing lock bolt, and
>since the local dealer whom I was considering have do the work hadn't
>ordered one either, I can only assume it would have been missed again
>even though the factory service manual list this as a "non reusable
>part" - and with good reason - the tip is neoprene, and when I removed
>the old bolt - the tip that actually locks the bearing rotation, was
>missing. Now I have the tools to change the ball joints, struts,
>springs, axles, etc., and was able to inspect them as well. Plus using
>the full polish high torque air gun with the 30mm impact socket for the
>axle nut was fun and effortless once I learned how to hold it properly
>and let it do the work.
>So, when you're dealing with dealers and their service department
>writers you'll have to decide for yourself.
>Personally, I'm not sure it's worth it.
>The standard procedure is to buy a car and replace it every few years.
>I'm convinced that one reason cars need periodic replacement is that
>mechanics under time pressure make little shortcomings that accumulate
>over time.
>If you could find a good mechanic or learn to do your own work, where
>you take the time to clean and examine each assembly as you go, with
>the pride of workmanship that derives from servicing your own vehicle,
>your Toyota can last virtually indefinitely. Case in point: my 1977
>Toyota pick up truck still operates flawlessly, and the 1994 Camry is
>as clean under the car as when new. Not a drop of oil anywhere, but . .
>. I've learned to replace all those oil seals your dealer is describing
>to you - plus many others, as a part of routine maintenance.
>If you do not replace oil seals, the car will still run.
>Once had a VW (in college) where I decided to rebuild the engine when
>it started using a quart a week - still ran fine though.
>Same with your Camry. Most people just let the oil leaks accumulate,
>rather than pay the cost of fixing them, then eventually replace the
>car.
>If you learn to enjoy doing your own mechanical work, then the cost of
>oil seals is minimal, usually only a few dollars apiece.



--
Message posted via http://www.carkb.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 18 Sep 2005, 09:28 am   #8 (permalink)
Daniel
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: 1999 Camry valve cover gasket and tube seals

The valve cover gasket and the timing belt are not related.
BTW, when I bought the Camry, I didn't even know how to change the air
filter, so reading the Internet groups over time helped me learn how to
change the timing belt, RH drive axle and oil pan gasket.
The reason I change the seals along with the timing belt, was advice I
read some time ago from "Cliff":
(and I added a few items of my own)
(btw, I bought a special tool from toolsource.com to install the cam
seal which made it very simple)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


We replace the VC gasket and tube seals, cam seal, front crank seal,
oil
pump seal, oil pump oring, tensioner (add spring) and idler bearings,
drive belts, water
pump (add gasket or O ring) and thermostat (add thermostat gasket) as
well as the timing belt. We use only OE or OEM
parts. That repair here in Austin is about $950

add: PCV valve and grommet, radiator cap, fuel filter, timing belt
cover gaskets, alternator brushes and holder (part number
"27370-35060", this is brushes and holder), fuel tank cap gasket -
77316-16010, wiper blades, gas cap,
Cliff<Toyota Master Tech


> Car is a 94/4 cyl Camry, and I see there is a revised tensioner
> spring, what color is the revised one? I see that the spring will
> be either silver or green. With the T-belt temporarily installed,
> what is the belt rotating procedure to verify timing sync before the
> spring loaded tensioner is tightened? One says go 1 7/8 turns (45
> BTDC) the other says two complete turns. Do any of you techs add a
> wee bit more than just spring pressure to the tensioner for future
> stretch compensation?


Jon, here is what I do on that 4 cylinder, first, the springs we use
are
#2 plated (kinda gold) orginal was silver. I set the belt in place so
the drive side is as tight as possible, then release the tensioner, now

wihtout moving anything, I will use a prybar and pry the idler real
tight (tensioner bolt is still lose) so as to remove and slack. Make
sure the water pump[ cogs are indexed intot he belt. Now tighten the
tensioner bolt, roll it over 2 revolutions at the crank, loosen the
tensioner bolt, pry out slack again, release the tensioner and tighten
the set bolt. Note, I never tighten the belt using the tensioner, only
let the spring adjsut, I only pry to remove any slack as the small
spring is not enough by itself. After the 2 revolutions, check all
timing marks to see if it stayed in place.


>
> Now the water pump. If I just want to change the pump (not the
> hosing that the thermostat is in), what is the general procedure?


Its tough, you will still need to remove the entire pump housing, as
some of the bolts that holt it together are the same ones that hold it
to the block, you will always want to replace the o-rings/gaskets
anyway. So I guess remove the entire pump, install just the cover on
the
bench and re-install.


>
> I ask, because I am not sure of which bolts come out? Do some bolts
> attach both the pump and housing, or do some bolts only attach the
> pump and are the only ones that need to come out?


Yes, there is 3 along the edge (left) that hold it to the block, the
lower bolt int he alt bracket and the lower idler has to come off,
along
with the obviuos pipe near the thermostat housing.



>
> It would seem if the bolt does both jobs (attach's the pump and
> clamps down the housing), that during its removal, the housing will
> be somewhat loose and the O ring seal between the block and housing
> will be destroyed. What am I missing?


Nothing, it will be a leaker!

*

Thanks for the help, and if you have time, I have a few more
questions please.

When you say "drive side" which side is that?

When you say pry the idler, you mean the tensioner idler/roller with
the slot that is not bolted tight?

Does the pwr steering pump have to be removed?

Do the spark plugs have to be removed? I have done other T-belt
changes with them left in.

After you unbolt and remove the dogbone/support rod, what about the
aluminum bracket that is over the timing covers. Is this removed
during a T-belt change? The two bolts that attach this bracket to
the engine are very close to the frame, and seem like they would not
come out unless the engine is out of the car?

Lastly, what size driver do you use or how do you install the cam
and crank seals? Room to drive the cam seal seems very tight.

Thank you very much for your time, it is very appreciated.

Jon




--- In Toyotas_Only@yahoogroups.com, toyota_mdt_tech <ssauer40@r...>
wrote:
> ndensoyzza2 wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > Car is a 94/4 cyl Camry, and I see there is a revised tensioner
> > spring, what color is the revised one? I see that the spring

will
> > be either silver or green. With the T-belt temporarily

installed,
> > what is the belt rotating procedure to verify timing sync before

the
> > spring loaded tensioner is tightened? One says go 1 7/8 turns

(45
> > BTDC) the other says two complete turns. Do any of you techs

add a
> > wee bit more than just spring pressure to the tensioner for

future
> > stretch compensation?

>
> Jon, here is what I do on that 4 cylinder, first, the springs we

use are
> #2 plated (kinda gold) orginal was silver. I set the belt in place

so
> the drive side is as tight as possible, then release the

tensioner, now
> wihtout moving anything, I will use a prybar and pry the idler

real
> tight (tensioner bolt is still lose) so as to remove and slack.

Make
> sure the water pump[ cogs are indexed intot he belt. Now tighten

the
> tensioner bolt, roll it over 2 revolutions at the crank, loosen

the
> tensioner bolt, pry out slack again, release the tensioner and

tighten
> the set bolt. Note, I never tighten the belt using the tensioner,

only
> let the spring adjsut, I only pry to remove any slack as the small
> spring is not enough by itself. After the 2 revolutions, check all
> timing marks to see if it stayed in place.
>
>
> >
> > Now the water pump. If I just want to change the pump (not the
> > hosing that the thermostat is in), what is the general procedure?

>
> Its tough, you will still need to remove the entire pump housing,

as
> some of the bolts that holt it together are the same ones that

hold it
> to the block, you will always want to replace the o-rings/gaskets
> anyway. So I guess remove the entire pump, install just the cover

on the
> bench and re-install.
>
>
> >
> > I ask, because I am not sure of which bolts come out? Do some

bolts
> > attach both the pump and housing, or do some bolts only attach

the
> > pump and are the only ones that need to come out?

>
> Yes, there is 3 along the edge (left) that hold it to the block,

the
> lower bolt int he alt bracket and the lower idler has to come off,

along
> with the obviuos pipe near the thermostat housing.
>
>
>
> >
> > It would seem if the bolt does both jobs (attach's the pump and
> > clamps down the housing), that during its removal, the housing

will
> > be somewhat loose and the O ring seal between the block and

housing
> > will be destroyed. What am I missing?

>
> Nothing, it will be a leaker!


*

ndensoyzza2 wrote:
> Thanks for the help, and if you have time, I have a few more
> questions please.
>
> When you say "drive side" which side is that?


Its the left hand side

>
> When you say pry the idler, you mean the tensioner idler/roller with
> the slot that is not bolted tight?


Yes.


>
> Does the pwr steering pump have to be removed?


No

>
> Do the spark plugs have to be removed? I have done other T-belt
> changes with them left in.


No, they can stay. It will make rolling the engine over easier though.

>
> After you unbolt and remove the dogbone/support rod, what about the
> aluminum bracket that is over the timing covers. Is this removed
> during a T-belt change? The two bolts that attach this bracket to
> the engine are very close to the frame, and seem like they would not
> come out unless the engine is out of the car?


It does need to come out, but its much easier to get to if you remove
the crank pulley first, then get those bolts from the underside.

>
> Lastly, what size driver do you use or how do you install the cam
> and crank seals? Room to drive the cam seal seems very tight.


Crank seal, I push it in with my hand, then gently drive it flush with
a
flat drift. As for cam seal, I use a special installer I bought,
without
it, its best if you remove the valve cover and the cam cap to do the
seal. Dont forget to apply some lube on the new seal lips.

  Reply With Quote

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:20 am.

Attribution:
Autoblog
Powered by Yahoo Answers



ToyotaLexusForum.com is an unofficial community for car enthusiasts. ToyotaLexusForum.com is not affiliated with Toyota Motor Corporation in any way.
Toyota Motor Corporation does not sponsor, support, or endorse ToyotaLexusForum.com in any way.
Copyright/trademark/sales mark infringements are not intended or implied.