Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

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Old 24 Feb 2006, 12:01 pm   #1 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

Ray, I appreciate reading all your posts concerning Toyota
mechanical problems. They are very informative, and I thank
you for them. You know your stuff. But I have to challenge
you here.

Technically, it's the ELEVENTH vin position that refers
to the plant. Recall my much earlier posting in this thread (I've
included a brief excerpt of it at the end of this message).

The first vin position involves the country of origin.

Now, I too, like you, originally thought that 1, 4, and 5
in the FIRST vin position *OF TOYOTA* vehicles (as opposed to
NISAN or DODGE) also referred to the *TOYOTA* plant of
final assembly--perhaps just a redundant reference to the plant in
addition to the ELEVENTH vin position (the ELEVENTH *officially*
refers to the plant). But Mike immediately
challenged me, saying 1, 4, and 5 in the FIRST vin position of
Toyotas is NOT a redundant reference to the plant. He says it
refers to the percentage of North American auto parts found in
the vehicle.

Considering that I have read independent sources confirming
that the ELEVENTH vin position officially refers to the plant, having
the FIRST vin position also refer to the plant is rather redundant.
But Ray you might be right. However, both of you cannot be
right--both you and Mike.

Here's the excerpt from my earlier post:

"....the 11th VIN position *officially* designates
the plant: "U" means Georgetown, KY. "Z"=Fremont, CA.
"S"=Princeton, IN. "C"=Canada.
Japan plants are represented by a number in
that 11th VIN position ("3" for example may be the
Tsutsumi plant--but of course a "3" in the *first* VIN
position means Mexico)."
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Old 24 Feb 2006, 05:16 pm   #2 (permalink)
Ray O
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over


"Built_Well" <bw@bbbb.com> wrote in message
news:Hf6dnWwQA5QJ1GLenZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@sysmatrix.ne t...
> Ray, I appreciate reading all your posts concerning Toyota
> mechanical problems. They are very informative, and I thank
> you for them. You know your stuff. But I have to challenge
> you here.
>
> Technically, it's the ELEVENTH vin position that refers
> to the plant. Recall my much earlier posting in this thread (I've
> included a brief excerpt of it at the end of this message).
>
> The first vin position involves the country of origin.


I am assuming that you have read the government standards regarding VIN
formatting as well as the explanation in the faq section of Toyota's web
site. Yes, the 11th position must refer to the assembly plant. The
standards also allow the manufacturer some leeway regarding the first 3
positions.

> Now, I too, like you, originally thought that 1, 4, and 5
> in the FIRST vin position *OF TOYOTA* vehicles (as opposed to
> NISAN or DODGE) also referred to the *TOYOTA* plant of
> final assembly--perhaps just a redundant reference to the plant in
> addition to the ELEVENTH vin position (the ELEVENTH *officially*
> refers to the plant). But Mike immediately
> challenged me, saying 1, 4, and 5 in the FIRST vin position of
> Toyotas is NOT a redundant reference to the plant. He says it
> refers to the percentage of North American auto parts found in
> the vehicle.


>
> Considering that I have read independent sources confirming
> that the ELEVENTH vin position officially refers to the plant, having
> the FIRST vin position also refer to the plant is rather redundant.
> But Ray you might be right. However, both of you cannot be
> right--both you and Mike.


If you read the federal guidelines on the VIN format (available for free
without having to pay Lexis Nexis), you will not find any reference to
domestic content, or at least I did not see any. I believe that Mike's
formulas may apply to Ford and/or GM but does not apply to all automakers in
the world. Think about this: if a Camry is made in Japan for sale in Japan
or Europe or anyplace in the world outside of North America, what difference
does North American content make to a buyer in Thailand?

The first three character positions must be consistent for a manufacturer
but I don't think every manufacturer must follow the exact same format for
the first 3 characters, other than the second one, which identifies the
manufacturer.

Mike worked for Ford, I worked for Toyota. If you want obscure information
about Fords, I would take Mike's knowledge over mine any day. If you want
obscure information about Toyota ...


--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)


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Old 24 Feb 2006, 06:10 pm   #3 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

Ray, thanks for your comments; I appreciate them. I always
appreciate your insightful answers.

But how do you explain Bonehenge's recent post saying
that the VIN of his 2005 Tacoma, made at NUMMI in Fremont, starts
with a "5"--not a "1"

Bonehenge wrote:
>
> My 2005 Tacoma starts with 5TEUU42...
> It's made in Fremont, CA, USA @ NUMMI, so I'm
> assuming "5" as a first digit is....

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Old 24 Feb 2006, 06:32 pm   #4 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

Bonehenge, would you mind telling us what the eleventh
character of your Tacoma's VIN is? Thanks a million, if
you can.
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Old 24 Feb 2006, 06:50 pm   #5 (permalink)
Bonehenge
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

On Fri, 24 Feb 2006 19:32:11 -0500, "Built_Well" <bw@bbbb.com> wrote:

>Bonehenge, would you mind telling us what the eleventh
>character of your Tacoma's VIN is? Thanks a million, if
>you can.


##### are serial digits

5TEUU42N65Z0(zero)#####

It's a 2005 Tacoma with major options 4WD / V6 / 6 speed manual / TRD
/ Access Cab / 50 state emissions, 02/05 NUMMI built (sticker and door
plate say so).

Let 'er rip! <G>
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Old 24 Feb 2006, 07:14 pm   #6 (permalink)
Built_Well
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over

Bonehenge wrote:
>
> 5TEUU42N65Z0(zero)#####



Eleventh character is a "Z" for NUMMI. Thanks a million
Bonehenge. Looks like all the '06 Tacomas at LongoToyota.com
also start with a 5 and show "Z" as the plant.

All this probably points to the Auto Parts percentage
explanation, but we still can't answer with certainty why
the VINs of the Georgetown '06 Camrys start with a "4" when
they have 80 percent North American parts content. Plus the
"Associated Press" AND Dan J.S. both mentioned their Siennas
have 90 percent American parts.
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Old 24 Feb 2006, 08:42 pm   #7 (permalink)
Ray O
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Default Re: Pick-up Truck Search Finally Over


"Built_Well" <bw@bbbb.com> wrote in message
news:_qGdnWGVW4GaPWLeRVn-vg@sysmatrix.net...
> Ray, thanks for your comments; I appreciate them. I always
> appreciate your insightful answers.
>
> But how do you explain Bonehenge's recent post saying
> that the VIN of his 2005 Tacoma, made at NUMMI in Fremont, starts
> with a "5"--not a "1"
>


I can't explain why Bonehenge's NUMMI-made Tacoma's VIN starts with a 5. As
I posted earlier, my theory is down the drain!

--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)


> Bonehenge wrote:
>>
>> My 2005 Tacoma starts with 5TEUU42...
>> It's made in Fremont, CA, USA @ NUMMI, so I'm
>> assuming "5" as a first digit is....



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