sludge symptoms?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 26 Feb 2006, 03:08 am   #1 (permalink)
onehappymadman@yahoo.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default sludge symptoms?

Short of disassembling the engine, how would you know if your engine
had sludge? What are the symptoms?

If you do have a moderate amount of sludge in the engine, how could it
be removed?

  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 07:16 am   #2 (permalink)
m Ransley
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?

Try looking in the oil fill hole, taking off the valve cover is best.
Sludge forms running a cold motor, never alowing it to run at full temp
long, such as 1-5 mile trips in winter. Changing oil by driving style,
having a good thermostat, longer operating times a working clean Pvc
system and good oil should keep sludge away. I think removing it can do
more harm as chemicaly flushing it could move it into blocking small
passages. Short 1-5 mile winter trips may reduce change intervals to
1000 miles. 5-6000 intervals are for highway trips or good driving where
the motor operates warm for most of the time. But winter is hardest on
oil.

  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 08:06 am   #3 (permalink)
Daniel
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?

onehappymad...@yahoo.com asked:
1) Short of disassembling the engine, how would you know if your
engine
had sludge? What are the symptoms?
and also asked:
2) If you do have a moderate amount of sludge in the engine, how could
it
be removed?
==================================
1) The best way to examine sludge is engine disassembly - but you only
have to remove one valve cover.
Would guess the next best proxy would be to examine the oil condition.
Does your oil go completely black on the dipstick over time, when
checked cold, or is there a portion of darker oil near the bottom and
lighter color near the top?
Sludge occurs when the oil can no longer hold contaminants in
suspension, but there aren't any progressive symptoms that are
noticeable in the way the engine runs.

2) See auto-rx.com
Changing the oil several times at short mileage intervals may also
help.
Solvents which loosen contaminants too quickly can clog small
passageways and are generally not recommended, though people always
seem to say good things about Seafoam.

  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 11:58 am   #4 (permalink)
johngdole@hotmail.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?

There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner EPA
certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler and
won't do that.

Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently to
see if the initial signs of the problem go away.

onehappymadman@yahoo.com wrote:
> Short of disassembling the engine, how would you know if your engine
> had sludge? What are the symptoms?
>
> If you do have a moderate amount of sludge in the engine, how could it
> be removed?


  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 05:36 pm   #5 (permalink)
mrdarrett@gmail.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?


johngdole@hotmail.com wrote:
> There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
> valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
> problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner EPA
> certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
> heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler and
> won't do that.
>
> Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently to
> see if the initial signs of the problem go away.



And a sludged engine will... do what, exactly? Give worse fuel
economy? Be more difficult to start? Stall more often? Fail smog
checks?

  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 06:56 pm   #6 (permalink)
m Ransley
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?

A sludged motor wil eventualy stop oil flow to critical areas by
clogging oil channels, and fail. I had a motor so badly sludged all the
oil would pool under the valve cover because the returns were sludged
shut and the oil light came on showing no oil. I removed the covers and
opened the holes while removing pounds of sludge. This previous owner
obviously never changed the oil. Sludge is like thick mud.

  Reply With Quote
Old 26 Feb 2006, 11:40 pm   #7 (permalink)
Jason James
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?


<mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1140997000.952116.182210@i39g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> johngdole@hotmail.com wrote:
> > There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
> > valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
> > problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner EPA
> > certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
> > heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler and
> > won't do that.
> >
> > Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently to
> > see if the initial signs of the problem go away.

>
>
> And a sludged engine will... do what, exactly? Give worse fuel
> economy? Be more difficult to start? Stall more often? Fail smog
> checks?


Sudden catastrophic engine failure if the sludge is heavy and a chunk floats
under the oil-pump pickup screen.

Jason


  Reply With Quote
Old 27 Feb 2006, 12:22 am   #8 (permalink)
onehappymadman@yahoo.com
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?


Jason James wrote:
> <mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1140997000.952116.182210@i39g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> >
> > johngdole@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
> > > valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
> > > problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner EPA
> > > certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
> > > heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler and
> > > won't do that.
> > >
> > > Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently to
> > > see if the initial signs of the problem go away.

> >
> >
> > And a sludged engine will... do what, exactly? Give worse fuel
> > economy? Be more difficult to start? Stall more often? Fail smog
> > checks?

>
> Sudden catastrophic engine failure if the sludge is heavy and a chunk floats
> under the oil-pump pickup screen.
>
> Jason



It sounds like the owner wouldn't know what hit him until it's too
late. Is this the case? No clue at all - from RPMs, or a sluggish
engine...?

  Reply With Quote
Old 27 Feb 2006, 05:51 am   #9 (permalink)
Jason James
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?


<onehappymadman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141021328.720870.298160@i39g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
> Jason James wrote:
> > <mrdarrett@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1140997000.952116.182210@i39g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> > >
> > > johngdole@hotmail.com wrote:
> > > > There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
> > > > valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
> > > > problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner

EPA
> > > > certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
> > > > heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler

and
> > > > won't do that.
> > > >
> > > > Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently

to
> > > > see if the initial signs of the problem go away.
> > >
> > >
> > > And a sludged engine will... do what, exactly? Give worse fuel
> > > economy? Be more difficult to start? Stall more often? Fail smog
> > > checks?

> >
> > Sudden catastrophic engine failure if the sludge is heavy and a chunk

floats
> > under the oil-pump pickup screen.
> >
> > Jason

>
>
> It sounds like the owner wouldn't know what hit him until it's too
> late. Is this the case? No clue at all - from RPMs, or a sluggish
> engine...?


What happens typically,..if the sludge build-up suddenly dettaches in a
critical area such as the main oil-feed driiling to the engine's main
bearings and bigends (conrods) and blocks or reduces flow enough, the engine
will start starving for lubrication at the main bearings and rod-bearings.
The oil-pressure gauge will keep reading normally has it is downstream from
the blockage, The driver ten has less than about 5 seconds to shutdown the
engine to avoid significant damage. If he's on a freeway, he may not
register with him whats going on before the engine crank is toast.

If the sump has enough sludge to partially or wholey block off the oil-pump
pickup,..then the driver will get an oil-pressure icon light up on dash. He
may, as a result save the engine by shutting it down quick enough,..but from
most of the engine failure reports due neglected maintenance, the engine is
still fried.

In mine which had a layer of tarry crap on the head looking thru the
oi-filler hole, they had removed the sunp to clean it out. I understand this
is mandatory amongst mechanics who come ecross abused engines.

Once oil-pressure is lost,..the engine will start belting itself to pieces,
especially if under high load (towing, cruising at speed etc)

Jason


  Reply With Quote
Old 27 Feb 2006, 06:59 am   #10 (permalink)
tww
Guest
  • Posts: n/a
  • User Status:


Default Re: sludge symptoms?


<johngdole@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1140976731.903209.112020@j33g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> There is no need to disassemble the entire engine. Just take off the
> valve covers for the sludge symptoms relating to Toyota engines. The
> problem is elevated combustion temperatures needed for the cleaner EPA
> certification (ULEV) and that oxidize/vaporize oil in the cylinder
> heads and overwhelm the PCV system. Pre 97 engines (LEV) run cooler and
> won't do that.
>
> Modern oils are detergent oils. Trying changing oil very frequently to
> see if the initial signs of the problem go away


We followed the recommended schedule of service every 5k miles at our local
Lexus dealer on an 01 RX300 and still had a sludge problem at 30k miles. You
probably need to change more often. Got rid of the car almost immediately.
Per the dealer, the Lexus solution to problem engines was to find a used
engine in a junkyard.

>
> onehappymadman@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Short of disassembling the engine, how would you know if your engine
> > had sludge? What are the symptoms?
> >
> > If you do have a moderate amount of sludge in the engine, how could it
> > be removed?

>



  Reply With Quote

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:45 pm.

Attribution:
Autoblog
Powered by Yahoo Answers



ToyotaLexusForum.com is an unofficial community for car enthusiasts. ToyotaLexusForum.com is not affiliated with Toyota Motor Corporation in any way.
Toyota Motor Corporation does not sponsor, support, or endorse ToyotaLexusForum.com in any way.
Copyright/trademark/sales mark infringements are not intended or implied.